OK, just for the sake of discussion...
Over the weekend I had an interesting historical chat with a Pard about how some 45/70 TD's were 'converted' to .410 Shotguns and used by the camp or Fort Cosie & crew to gather small game for the pot, etc. So, with that in mind, he then tried to convince me that any 45/70 cartridge would be usable in any .410 Shotgun and vice versa.
After mulling it over for awhile and expostulating on all the possible problems, I now defer to those pros here that can set things straight, so here goes:
1. Can a .410 shell be shot in any 45/70 Rifle?
2. Can any 45/70 cartridge be shot in any .410 Shotgun?
Hoping to get some interesting and educational comments. For comparison, he was talking about using an H&R Handi-Rifle in 45/70 and a .410 Shotgun in the same make.
Best regards and good shooting!
'Ol Gabe
The conversions I know of, the forager gun were 20 gauge, I need to look at the chamber dimesions, but I think no as far as being safe. I've heard this story from others before, none who have told it to me are the kind I would leave a building because the hollored fire, I would have to see the smoke and flames first.
Hmm, a bit more coffee and I'll head to the reading room. ;)
Some guys have very interesting ideas - this one qualifies...
The Army used a purpose-built 'Forager's Shotgun' in 20 gauge.
They were specifically built at Springfield Armory, using the Trapdoor action - and somewhere in the archives of 'The Historical Society Forum', The NCOWS Forum' or 'The Barracks' - there's a fairly long post.
It started out as something trying to justify the use of shotgun slides and shotgun belts - so you'll have to dig for it.
If you don't want to do the digging - pick up a copy of 'The Trapdoor Springfield' - by Waite and Ernst - Chapter 9 is devoted to it.
Vaya,
Scouts Out!
Well I done the digging, I think the cartridge drawings speak for themselves.
45-70
(http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/Delmonico_1885/gun%20gear/Copyofscan0001.jpg)
410, cut 1/2 inch off for the short one. Mostly seen today in the more expensive skeet loads.
(http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/Delmonico_1885/gun%20gear/scan0001.jpg)
The 45-70 in the 410 would be real intersting since most of the "Toppers" in 410 are on the older, frame with less strength. Not that I wwould, but I think putting a 45 Colt Cylinder on a Blackhawk in 41 mag and firing the 45 round in it would be safer, more strength and at least a gap to vent some of the gasses. It would still be trying to shove a 45 caliber bullet down a 0.410 bore.
The 2 1/2 inch or 3 inch 410 in the 45-70might be ok in an emergency where you need food and found youself with that round and a 45-70 with no ammo, but I doubt many would find themselves in that situation.
I have HEARD of the opposite! .410s in a .444 Marlin. I wouldn't try what is suggested. I can get into enough trouble without trying this hard.
Quote from: Sir Charles deMoutonBlack on October 02, 2007, 10:31:06 AM
I have HEARD of the opposite! .410s in a .444 Marlin. I wouldn't try what is suggested. I can get into enough trouble without trying this hard.
Would be very consticted on the other end, but have heard the same, heading to work right now, so I don't have time to scan that drawing, I'll do it later.
Yepper,
I knew I might have been guppied into something odd but I wanted to get the 'straight stuff' here first before I responded to him. Thanks Del, St. George and all for your replies, knew I could count on you!
Best regards and good shooting!
'Ol Gabe, getting ready to spin him a story about...well, its a good one and he'll never figure it out!
We used .444 Marlin brass in the 410, as I wanted brass shells. Works great and we loaded them to 410 specs.
Kayleen
Quote from: Kayleen on October 04, 2007, 09:15:29 AM
We used .444 Marlin brass in the 410, as I wanted brass shells. Works great and we loaded them to 410 specs.
Kayleen
Now that would be safe. Some guns might have extraction probles with the smaller rim.
444 Marlin
(http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i200/Delmonico_1885/gun%20gear/scan0003-1.jpg)