Another Newbie Question

[JD Alan]

Howdy guys. I have a problem that I've not seen addressed here before. The picture below is a work in progress of a 1911 holster. I'm not done with any of the edges yet. I did not do as good a job with the filler piece as I would have liked.

This is not the end of the earth, but there are a couple of places that I don’t like the look of after I’ve sanded the back down as much as I think I can get away with.

In wood working you can use putty to fill in small gaps, so I’m wondering if anyone does anything like that with leather? I’m guessing not, or I would have heard about it by now, but I thought what the heck, I might as well ask. After taking a close look at it again I may well try to bring it down a little more, but I think there will still be a couple of ugly spots there.

The next filler piece I put it will have a lot more care involved in its placement.   

[EE Taft]

I've never used any fillers or anything like that, but I understand your point.  In that situation I would try to take it down as much as you can without degrading the strength of the stitches. Break out the big guns if ya have to and lay that puppy on a belt sander or fine wheel grinder. You can also fix some of it in the slicking process after a touch up sanding.

Just remember, don't go crazy with the power tools. little bites, little bites!!!!

Holster looks great. Are you sure your just getting started?
~EE Taft~

[JD Alan]

The more I look at it the more I'm inclined to take it down some more. I've been messing around with leather about two years now, with 6 months off for a stroke. I still have what I consider "New guy" questions from time to time, and this was one of them.

Thanks for the response, JD

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[TN Mongo]

JD,

Allow more distance from the edge of the holster to your stitching line than you do on the rest of the holster.  I use 5/16" from the edge to the welt stitching line and 3/16" on the rest of the holster.  This will give you enough leather to use a belt sander, as previously mentioned, or a sanding drum insert for a drill press.  Using one of these power tools or even a drum sander
on a Dremel tool will allow you to get a nice smooth welt.  After I use a sanding drum, I use several grits of finer sand paper by hand to smooth the welt even more.  I normally finish with 600 grit and then I burnish the welt.

You can fill in some small areas with paraffin or a paraffin beeswax miix and then buff that with a small piece of canvas.

[JD Alan]

Howdy Mongo, I appreciate you weighing here, and you've been a big help to me in the past. With all due respect, I know what I did wrong, I was in too much of a hurry to take the care to do it correctly, a dumb mistake.

Now paraffin or that mixed with beeswax is something to give a try

I went ahead a sanded down the edge again, and it looks much better. I still have one area that might be a candidate for the wax; we'll see!

Thanks Mongo, JD

[MontanaSlick]

JD, yer did great Pard, I've had the same problem untill I started using my Drimmel along with a worn sanding drum.
It's more gentile to the leather and smooths things out.
I'm going to re work some of my older projects and smooth them out.
For a final I use a shoe brush in a wool sock and polish the edges, makes em smooth and a burnish look

Keep us posted and the piks look great.

MS

[JD Alan]

Montana, I use a Dremel (once again Chuck Burrows DVD) for the places I can't get to with a sander. I should have left more of the filler out to be able to match up the edges better. I ended up having to skive around the screw holes on the inside of the belt keeper flap. I used 8/9 leather with a 4/5 liner, and it was too thick for the Chicago screws. I put T-nuts in this time, with the points cut down, to make sure they don't spin inside the liner like the last holster I did.

I figure once I make another dozen ot two holsters of the same style I might, and I stress might work all the bugs out.

When I finish this one I'm going to write out a build sheet; something a gun smith friend of mine does on every gun he works on. I will list the mistakes I made on this one, so as to remind me, (if I think to look at the sheet!) of things NOT to do on the next one.     

[cowboywc]

Howdy JD
Use the beeswax when you have finished sanding as much as you can. I have an old sanding block with cow suede on it. I rub the wax into the edge and the rub hard with the block to melt and spread the wax to an even finish.Then add your favorite edge dressing.  Been doing this for years.
WC

[Slowhand Bob]

Boy did that snow work some majik on me last night, I slept the best part of the morning away.  JD, I am actually having problems with the extra thick fillered edges myself right now, amongst other things.  Since I am machine sewing, and therein lies most of my problems, you are perhaps doing things a bit different.  Just a couple of thoughts, cut your insert just a hair wider than necessary and install that tiny bit extra as overhang.  If you are having trouble with keeping it even then cheat slightly and let it be the part that protrudes.  If you desire fillers then avoid thin ones, they twist and roll on you to much while working and sewing.  Do not just look at it flat, turn it up and sight along the edges as you hold them into alignment, especially at the toe and mouth bends.  That bit of slight protrusion on the filler is ok BUT you must try try to keep the top and bottom edges of the main body even at the spot where the liner stitching and main seam stitch will meet....(even use a light pencil mark on the edges to help lighn up those stitch marks if necessary.   I use strong spring clamps on the main seam while the glue sets, keep the leather seam area dry and the clamp jaws padded.  After the glue sets I go to the sander to dress the main seam down but try to do it with ight strokes and keep away from the starting points of the existing liner stitching as it is already at the proper distance from the edge and you went to extra trouble to keep those two important spots on the fillered edge just right, right?  I do a light pass on the sander face up and then flip it over and do another light pass with the holster face down, repeating until I have a nice even edge and shaped the way I want it.  Even with these light strokes you are miles ahead of the guys working it by hand with sanding sponges plus you are not unnecessarily bulging the leather with pressure.  Now is when I like to edge those corners and go back over it with a warn out sanding sponge.  If everything has remained really lose on those all important stitch meeting points at the top and bottom of the mainseam then your stitch groover should be able to meet at them with the previous setting.  All the rest of that mainseam can be done as a free flowing process, within the bounds of your pattern, because the groover simply follows them.  This should leave very little space for the need of filing with wax.     

[JD Alan]

WC and Slowhand Bob, two of my favorite guys, and two of the most helpful to me on this forum; thanks to both of you for the generous sharing of your experience and knowledge.

I am hand sewing the main seam and I clamp when I glue and most definitely pad those clamps! I did not pay as much attention to the top and bottom of the filler, or the rest of it for that matter. That’s a mistake I will try not to do again.  I will work in some beeswax in a couple of areas where it’s not quite as even as the rest of the seam.

As to the width of the filler, this is the first one I ran the full length of the holster, just because I hadn’t done it before, and I though it might look better. Whether is does or not is a matter of opinion I guess.

The holster is coming together, and I’m applying the first coat of Skidmores today. I still need to build a double mag pouch, something I’ve not done before. I’m going to use a pattern Marshall Will so kindly gave me.

Thanks again to everyone who responded, I do appreciate the knowledge you’ve shared, JD

Now I’m off to the range this Saturday morning!

[Johnny McCrae]

Howdy JD,
I bought an Oscillating Rotary Sander (center machine) mainly for shaping grips. I've found that it works pretty good on the edges of holsters and that's all I use now. It gives me a square and clean edge.

I also found the Bandsaw handy for cutting very thick and stiff leather to a pattern size.

[EE Taft]

I don't for the life of me know why I didn't mention bees wax, I use it on every project.  I guess when you said filler and wood it just registered wrong.  I get like that sometimes.

Mush on gentlemen!

~EE Taft~

[JD Alan]

EE Taft I appreciate you sharing your experience.

Johnny, would you recommend a oscillating sander over a belt if you could only have one?   

[Johnny McCrae]

Howdy JD,

If I only could have one sander for leather work it would definitely be an Oscillating Sander.

All I use on the Belt Sander is the "disc attachment" for beveling the bottoms of pistol grips. I hardly ever use the belt. The Oscillating Sander also works great for shaping grips.

[MontanaSlick]

JD,
I havent seen any Skidmores kin ya tell me a little about it?


MS

[Slowhand Bob]

WOW, what a question!  I do have both, got the little hobby belt sander after seeing Chucks video but was very happy with my old oscillating drum sander prior to that.  I still go to the drum most often but would probably choose the little belt sander as my only one allowed.  Do not forget that you also have the roll over at the top, though a bit larger than what I keep in the drum sander.
I really would like to see about three diameters of drums stacked vertically on a non oscillating shaft but this is getting a bit over specialized for anything beyond a home made tool.  My little belt sander came from LOWES and carries the Delta brand (used to mean something) but prehaps you might need to cheat a bit and check HOME DEPOT.  At one time they carried a combination belt/drum sander and may still have them???  Now I need to try and find something to offer Marshall Will for trade towards one of those mag pouch patterns!  Robby; who loves anything free.        

[JD Alan]

I don't own either type of sander, but since they have to do with wood working, I could most likely sell my wife on the need for both, since she likes to work with wood. I could tell her she's getting too old to sand by hand, but then I would have to have STUPID written across my forehead, and last time I shaved I didn't see that

Thanks for your input Johnny, I appreciate it.

Robby, since Marshall shared the pattern with me, I don't see any reaon not to share it with you. I had a wood working friend cut me some pieces of wood the size of single and double stack mags to use for wet molding, but I've yet to try that. The good Lord willing, this is the week!

I need to get ready for church (they expect me to be there most every Sunday) but I will look that pattern up & send it to you ASAP, if Marshall will doesn't beat me to it. He sure is one great guy.

Thanks Pards! JD

[Marshal Will Wingam]

Johny, that drum sander is a cool tool for the job. I have a bench belt/disk sander similar to yours but for edges, It owuld be nice to have the drum. One of these days when I have more room, perhaps.

[Johnny McCrae]

I might add that it took a little practicing to learn how to use the Oscillating Sander for Holster edges. You have to press the leather lightly against the spindle. Too much pressure and you get a lip on the edge. You also have to make sure your sanding drums are fresh and not get too worn down. IMHO, it does a pretty good job on edges. What I like most is it produces a square edge.

MS,
Check out this link for information on Skidmore's   http://www.skidmores.com/

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

   As Johnny points out watch how you hold your leather piece, and you want to keep it moving, if not these sanders will take a lot off in one area in a hurry and you will end up with an uneven edge. I use three power sanders, one is a Rigid oscillating belt and spindle combination sander, a Craftsman belt / disk sander, and an Oscillating Spindle sander like Johnny's, that I got from Harbor Freight, and I also use my Dremmel with a small sanding drum which I keep close by on my tooling bench for last minute touch ups along with some sanding sponges. I find they all have there uses and all come in very handy for different applications of work, getting a 90 degree edge on seam lines is a breeze using these tools, and make short work of it. After sanding I do my edge beveling, and stitch grooving, Here's a picture of my set up in my Man Cave.

          tEN wOLVES