Building of a reliable c&b 47 Walker

[Willie Dixon]

Hey all,

basically I'm going to start a thread of my work I'm doing to an Uberti Walker Colt I just picked up.  She's a great gun out of the box and her timing is nice, but there's still some things I'm going to try to help make her more reliable when it comes to the action inside and the issues with colts and their caps  

To start with, I'll post up a pick tomorrow of the Walker disassmebled and show where I've already seen some issues.  Also, I figure for anyone working on Dragoons, this could help as well since all the big'uns are pretty similar.  Also any feedback, criticism and advice from others is greatly appreciated.

[Kent Shootwell]

I found the book by Jerry Kuhnhuausen "The Colt single action Revolvers" A shop manual, volumes 1&2  to be very helpful even for working cap and ball revolvers. He has many tips on things to do and as important on what not to do. Covered also is the metal and heat treat used in replicas. A very detailed book.

[Galloway]

I'd like to see you address the droping loading lever problem.

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[Willie Dixon]

First to Mr. Kent,

thanks for the great tip on a SAA Colt book!  I noticed, too how similar the Walker is to the more modern SAAs.  Luckily, my family has had a 1880s SAA in the family for generations.  And I couldn't help but notice how similar the timing mechanisms were between them.  I truly believe Colt came up with a wonderful design.

To Mr. Galloway,

actually Sir, after reading some reports of Texas Rangers that carried the Walker, one way they kept the lever up was shooting in an "off-hand" style, similar to a rifle by keeping the gun rested on the left wrist.  Now seeing as most wore the Elkskin cavalry gauntlets of the era, it would suffice it could work, as long as no chain fires erupted.

I, myself, sir, shooting duelist am taking the easy way out.  I'm going to make up a cool Dine' inspired wrap that will hold the lever up.  My catch actually broke off entirely already.  

It is interesting to note, the original Walker I was fortunate enough to help restore in Texas at a museum, had a much stronger lever catch than the one being used by Uberti.  

Right now, I have the gun fully disassembled and I'm checking out the internals for burrs, casting seams, and the like and am filing those down.  Once I have that done, I will post up picks of the disassembled Walker before and after the work being completed.

Any one wish for a "how to disassemble?" instructions?  I know most of us know how, and youtube has a great video of the Dragoon being taken down.  But, for the novice, it couldn't hurt.

Now I have questions for everyone else, actually just one

any tricks to getting the hilt back on with the backstrap set up the way it is?!?  Man is that fun!  The older Walker, probably from years of use and then age on top of that was nowhere near as strong as this one is!

[Crow Choker]

Willie-How's the project going? Just curious. Yers, Crow Choker

[Montana Slim]

I've a 3rd Model Uberti Dragoon....similar design...I have to say it's as reliable or more-so than my best irons.....even compared to my rather extensive collection of 1860's, which run near 100%. Nice feature is that the mainspring is nice & heavy...but manageable. Always busts caps...never drops em in the action of my hand. Makes a marvelous bludgeon after you've emptied it into your opponents as well. Definitely has some heft.

To bring the POI down a shade, you might want to deepen the rear sight notch and perhaps shave off some of the top-lip of the hammer as well (where the notch is). I performed this operation...also replaced the loading lever spring (coil)....and gave a trigger job to my revolver.

A plus with the Walker is the extra barrel length which puts you a foot closer to your opponents...and these guns hit as hard as any of our main-stage leverguns

Kudos to Uberti for these fine irons.

Regards,
Slim

[Willie Dixon]

Montana Slim,

I've got a question about your 3rd model Dragoon.  Does that have the screw-in type main spring?  I've been looking at schematics and it appears so.  Only problem is that it would require a change in the trigger guard as well to convert my walker to that style spring.  The spring in the walker is held on by tension between it and a notch in the trigger guard.  To say it's a workout getting that in and out would be a mass understatement.  

But I was also wondering if there were a way to just modify my trigger guard to tap and die a screw into there, thus allowing the 3rd model Dragoon's main spring?

Also, as of this moment, I've just been working on filing down all the burs, and giving the gun an action job between the trigger, bolt, and trigger bolt spring and just trying to get the creep out of there.  Right now I've been using all hand files, Craftsman brand as that's what I have for my automotive work.  After I get everything finely sanded, I'll be polishing them out as well.

Luckily, I also have access to a place that will allow me to color-case harden everything again if the colors get marred by my work.

Also, I've seen other people's work on their arbor and cylinder, in order to help with blackpowder buildup.  Do you think this is a good idea?  I've read quite a few ideas, but I haven't been able to see pictures or anything else that would allow me to act with confidence in working on that section.

Also another question for all the open-top owners:  Any problems with the slot for the wedge between the arbor and the barrel not lining up?  I've had the arbor checked, it's actually plum flush and square, but there's about a 1/16" out of alignment between the arbor slot and the slots for the barrel.  I've thought about filing down and opening up the arbor's slot, so as not to mess with the purdy blue on the barrel, but I'm worried that will make the wedge and the barrel loose!  

Right now, that's my biggest conundrum, as I have no way to actually re-assemble the gun right now lol

Also, here's that great disassembly video I found on youtube.  I figure I'll just post this link, it does a great job.  Better than I can with just pictures. 

[Flint]

To modify the Walker to use the Dragoon mainspring would require replacing the hammer as well, since the Walker hammer does not have a roller for the flat spring.  If you replace the triggerguard and backstrap, you might have to replace the wood grips with a custom set that will fill the scoop cut into the frame.  I think the profile is different enough that a Walker wood may not fit in a Dragoon frame.

One way to control the loading lever is to dovetail in a 3rd Model Dragoon lever latch and install a 3rd Model Dragoon lever.  The 1st and 2nd Model have a vertical latch and the 3rd Model is horizontal like the Army and Navy, it's more reliable and more comfortable to press on.

[Montana Slim]

I've never had any issues with fouling buildup on Colt C&B revolvers.
I use only dab of over-ball lube to maintain accuracy...too much is a mess.

I have modified various pistols to load paper cartridges, along with general de-burring, trigger jobs and re-timing when needed.

Gess I need to get a Walker one of these days to experiment on working out their minor kinks....it is enjoyable.

Regards,
Slim

[Angel_Eyes]

This thread is most opportune as I have just got my Walker a little brother, a 2nd Model Dragoon.
Don't know how it runs yet but,,,,come the weekend I will find out!

I have already found out that what Flint sez about the loading lever catch is true, awkward little devil, aint it?

The Walker came without the lever catch, so I made my own from some spare Titanium plate that was kicking around the shed.
Made it with a sharper 'shelf' than the original,,,now it stands up to full loads.

AE

[will52100]

Titanium?  Now that's an idea, wish I'd thought of it when I was working on mine.  I wound up fileing a catch on the spring cam, have to us a screw driver or the powder flask spout to release the leaver now, but no more droping the loading leaver, ever!

[Willie Dixon]

Hey guys,

I know it's been a long time, and sorry about that.  Real life can be a big pain sometimes 

Mr. Angel_Eyes, any chance of getting pics of that titanium catch you created? It'd be sweet to not need any external modifications such as straps to get the lever held up.

Currently, my Walker is out of commission.  The arbor on it is way of parallell, and as such the barrel/cylinder gap has a massive pie shape to it.  The other two open tops I've purchased, (pietta Navy .44 and Uberti Navy Open Top 45lc) I checked them out, and field stripped them in the store to make sure they were sound before purchasing.

I think I may have to go to Saber River Gunsmithing down in prescott to save my walker and get her firing.  The rest of the internals however, I followed this simple "how-to" by Larsen E. Pettifogger from the Cowboy Chronicle.  I found them on The Open Range.

here's a link:
http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=7988.0

hope this helps everyone else.

I really do love this Walker, and I plan on buying either a Dragoon or another Walker to use as a set. As you can see from my other pistols, I'm definitely "warthog" country

[chris hickey]

I shoot a pair of Walkers with Kirst Konverters in BPGF catagory and overcame the loading lever problem by drilling and tapping a fourth screw onto the end of the loading lever see pic. to use the loading i simply undue the screw half a turn and use it.
Hope it helps
Hick

[MJN77]

All I did to stop the lever from dropping on my walker was to file a little flat spot on top of the lever latch. It doesn't even drop with 60 grain charges. Just make sure you don't file it completely flat or it won't come down even when you want it to. Leave a slight curve to it.

This is not my pic but it's the same thing I did to my walker.

[Bonnie_blue1861]

That's an interesting mod to keep the loading lever from dropping. I might try that on my Uberti.

[Thumper]

Excellent fix Chris!!

[rifle]

I like the way MJM77 did the loading lever spring. That method can be used to get the exact amount of hold up for whatever amount of powder you use. I use 45gr. in my Walker and have my spring shaped to hold up reliably at 50gr. That way it still pulls down easily. I had it set for 55-60gr. but don't use that much powder fer it. I have the chambers reamed and they create more pressure sos I might be making 55-60gr. worth of pressure with 45gr. powder. Anyway the sharper the angle to the top of that hump on the spring retainer the more the hold up powder. It can be made,as someone mentioned, to need the spring tip pressed with a little screw driver or sumpthin to release but will never fall down from shootin unless the spring breaks.
Someone mentioned filing or evening up the wedge/barrel slots on their Walker. Hold off on that till you know how the slots should be. They are even top and bottom but not end to end. End to end the arbor slot at the rear is inside the barrels rear slot and forward the arbor slot is outside the barrel slot. So...the wedge only pushes on the arbor at the front and the barrel at the rear to push the barrel to the rear.So the slots aren't even at the front or the rear....only the top and bottom. The top and bottom of the slots don't need to be perfectly flush but just don't need a "ledge" for the wedge to hit and get stopped before it goes thru. A bevel on any ledge inside the slots can stop that though.
I have to mention.......Thumper makes some nice brass stoppers or retainers to hold up Walker loading levers. Like a blacksmith fix one might find backin the day.
I have to mention(always mentioning sumpthin) that once a person messes with Walkers enough they can learn to put the mainspring on and off the gun by "hand". Just get it and the hand supported in the right manner and slip the spring on and off by hand.
I have to mention......if a person makes lube pills/grease cookies and makes them right and not too soft or hard using those right on top yer powder under the balls can negate any need/attempt at gunsmithing a cylinder front bushing or whatever to keep the cylinder turning all day. Lube pills can keep the cylinder from binding up many many shots. If need be a little blackpowder solvent when the cylinder does turn hard from fouling will get it turning easy again.

I posted sumpthin just today about arbors(again) and that might be a help to someone with the out of parallel arbor. Posted at STORM about an 1860 Colt with a loose arbor. Is that where I am now?ha ha ha