45-75 Brass?

[Coal Creek Griff]

Unless someone knows otherwise, it appears that Jamison has discontinued 45-75 brass.  Other brands seem to be much more costly, especially for correct headstamps.  Are there other good options?  I seem to suffer split case mouths more with this caliber than others (yes, I anneal and I'm as gentle as I can be in sizing, belling, crimping, etc).  I'm nearing the point where I'd like to order more, but I'm dismayed to find sources somewhat lacking...

CC Griff

[Four Eyes Henry]

You could try 50 alaskan, a 348 win based case...

[greyhawk]

Unless someone knows otherwise, it appears that Jamison has discontinued 45-75 brass.  Other brands seem to be much more costly, especially for correct headstamps.  Are there other good options?  I seem to suffer split case mouths more with this caliber than others (yes, I anneal and I'm as gentle as I can be in sizing, belling, crimping, etc).  I'm nearing the point where I'd like to order more, but I'm dismayed to find sources somewhat lacking...

CC Griff

Darn!! I was hoping they would do another run - I have plenty of 348 based stuff but some correct headstamped woulda been nice.

[greyhawk]

You could try 50 alaskan, a 348 win based case...

I formed 150 from 348 winchester brass - only lost a couple of cases in the process - lots of annealing and several steps - these are tough cases! Was a tad disappointed at the end, my cases have a definite coke bottle profile near the base - my 348 cases are well under spec at .543 base measure - blown out the body measures .556 so my 45-75 chamber is undersize as well - there is a 1918 case drawing from winchester that shows .564 base ---anyone confused yet?   ............I bet winchester deliberately made this brass undersized so it could be used to form the 41 Swiss. Some Jamison brass woulda been nice if it was the correct size ....................

[Coal Creek Griff]

Rats. I was hoping to avoid forming my own brass.  I also much prefer proper headstamps.  I've sent suggestions to Starline that they take up this caliber, but I doubt that it would be a good investment for them--no doubt that's why Jamison has discontinued their production.

I've read elsewhere here that 50-90 brass might be a better choice as donor cases for forming 45-75 brass.  Does anyone have experience to confirm or deny that suggestion?

I'm still muttering under my breath in disgust...

CC Griff

[dusty texian]

CCG I have brass formed from 50-90 Sharps (Starline ) brass  to 45-75 , purchased from Buffalo Arms yrs. ago . don't know if its better  . It has held up very well countless reloadings  use BP. only and the Winchester tong tool , so it does not get worked very much. Head spaces well in original rifles that I have . Kind of Kicking myself in the rear for not stocking up on available brass when it was offered . ,,DT

[kwilliams1876]

i made a bunch of cases awhile by fire forming .348 win brass.......by the time they had been formed a couple of times to get them filled out i found that many have oversize primer pockets and while cycling the gun several primers would fall out. first and only time in my reloading career this has happened. was using cream of wheat and bullseye.
kw

[larryo1]

Well, I guess that I must put in my two bits here. When I first got my 45-75, dumb ol' me got a bunch of 348 brass.  They did "Coke Bottle" on me but then after 4 or shots that disappeared and they are fine now.  When I fire-formed them I used "Cream of Wheat" and Bullseye. Then topped that off with a Beeswax plug.  No problems whatsoever.  Then another stupid stunt was when I bought a gob of Bertram Brass.  Way too much bucks for me.  Then I went to 50-90 Sharps brass and no problems and then I got a whole gob of Jamison 45-75 cases with that headstamp that we all cherish so much.  Now to make a long story short, I would use 348 cases as they are tough and dependable even to they do "Coke Bottle" but that is easy to get rid of. Now, the other thing that has been mentioned is the problem of case cracking.  All I can say is that I anneal about every 4 or 5 rounds and have had no problems.  Maybe I am some sort of "Gilded Lilly" but that is what I do and have done with my rifle and it dont seem to make any difference with either Black or Smokeless.  My rifle has the Uberti chamber that is a bit larger than the original chamber and that is how I can get 76 grains of BP in the cases.  Works great but has a bit more recoil.  Makes me think that  those Mounties were real gorillas as they used these rifles for many years with thos BP loads.

[greyhawk]

Well, I guess that I must put in my two bits here. When I first got my 45-75, dumb ol' me got a bunch of 348 brass.  They did "Coke Bottle" on me but then after 4 or shots that disappeared and they are fine now.  When I fire-formed them I used "Cream of Wheat" and Bullseye. Then topped that off with a Beeswax plug.  No problems whatsoever.  Then another stupid stunt was when I bought a gob of Bertram Brass.  Way too much bucks for me.  Then I went to 50-90 Sharps brass and no problems and then I got a whole gob of Jamison 45-75 cases with that headstamp that we all cherish so much.  Now to make a long story short, I would use 348 cases as they are tough and dependable even to they do "Coke Bottle" but that is easy to get rid of. Now, the other thing that has been mentioned is the problem of case cracking.  All I can say is that I anneal about every 4 or 5 rounds and have had no problems.  Maybe I am some sort of "Gilded Lilly" but that is what I do and have done with my rifle and it dont seem to make any difference with either Black or Smokeless.  My rifle has the Uberti chamber that is a bit larger than the original chamber and that is how I can get 76 grains of BP in the cases.  Works great but has a bit more recoil.  Makes me think that  those Mounties were real gorillas as they used these rifles for many years with thos BP loads.

My problem is all the 348 brass I have is already well under spec (at least ten thou under) so the coke bottle look is permanent - that Winchester 348 brass measures .544 at the head and the blown out body of the fireformed 45-75 case is .556 ...easy to see that and it aint goin away. Its good tough brass - just a shame it was made with so much tolerance in the first place. 

[King Medallion]

Not sure by what you mean by "coke bottle". Does that mean it has like a little "waist" in the middle? I have one box of 20 .348 brass that came with my rifle, was hard to close the lever with them, so just got set aside till needed. Is Jamison completely out of business now or whats the scoop with them? Sent an email to Starline a few days ago about 45/75 bass, no reply.

[greyhawk]

Not sure by what you mean by "coke bottle". Does that mean it has like a little "waist" in the middle? I have one box of 20 .348 brass that came with my rifle, was hard to close the lever with them, so just got set aside till needed. Is Jamison completely out of business now or whats the scoop with them? Sent an email to Starline a few days ago about 45/75 bass, no reply.

The 348 brass takes some blowing out (4 full case blackpowder loads at least)
mine are .544 at the solid head and at .150 away from the base the case starts to swell out - at .300 from the base it measures .557 ...at the start of the shoulder it still measures .550 ....my LEE FL size die is .554 (about right I say) ....the case specifications that I can find say .552 for a 348 - so they made that brass 8 thou undersize - hence the coke bottle thing when we convert it - I tried to get mine out concentric when I was forming so I loaded them swelled side down for the second form load etc . so the waist you see is the solid head area - between the rim and the start of the body - then fat body - then that milk bottle shape shouklder/neck - its not a big deal - tough cases - but woulda looked nice with a straight er body at the rear end. 

[Coal Creek Griff]

Thanks, fellas.  I have enough Jamison brass for now, but I'm going to have to gear up to form my own before too long.  I appreciate the input and advice.

CC Griff

[King Medallion]

did jamison go out of business or just doing military stuff for now?

[Coal Creek Griff]

I believe that they are still in business, but they're just focusing on different calibers. I have sent them a message inquiring about 45-75, I have not received a reply.

CC Griff

[greyhawk]

I believe that they are still in business, but they're just focusing on different calibers. I have sent them a message inquiring about 45-75, I have not received a reply.

CC Griff

Probably a bean counter at Jamison - figured out most of us with a 76 have brass enough to function so its a small market now - ten years ago with lots of rifles selling to guys with no supplies ...............different economics.  If they made it I would buy some but can get along without so instead of the two hundred I woulda bought - I might now take 50. Bertram probably makes some in aussieland but I am not desperate enough to pay the price.
 

[Coal Creek Griff]

One factor in my preparation to form my own brass is that I'll need a new case trimmer.  My Wilson trimmer is a work of art, but not suitable for 45-75. I've been feeling the need anyway for my 56-50 Spencer brass. Does anyone know if the Lyman Universal Trimmer would work for those calibers?

CC Griff

[greyhawk]

One factor in my preparation to form my own brass is that I'll need a new case trimmer.  My Wilson trimmer is a work of art, but not suitable for 45-75. I've been feeling the need anyway for my 56-50 Spencer brass. Does anyone know if the Lyman Universal Trimmer would work for those calibers?

CC Griff

I have a Lyman universal trimmer - it works - fiddly getting the case secured in the chuck/holder but it fits.
Most of the cutting I did in my lathe - made a die / holder / thingy from a big old one inch nut and bolt
My process was
1) reduce the length of the 348 case by turning MOST of the excess length off of the neck
2) Anneal the case to about two thirds down
3) neck expand - do this in as many steps as you can - so I went to 375, then to .401, then to 457
I made expander plugs with a long slow taper - you will find bolts that thread into the body of common reloading dies - just cut the head off, turn the body to size and POLISH it, plenty of lube. (one of the die companies was advertising expander kit for close on two hundred bucks) 
4) go shoot! I used blackpowder full case loads from the start. The rifle didnt shoot too bad with the forming loads - I figured might as well start having fun as soon as possible - fireforming with special loads looked like work to me.
There will be some length shrinkage - so at the start make your cases as long as the chamber will allow - I would shoot em at least twice (or more) with blackpowder before the final trim - my cases ended up a tad short because I didnt leave myself enough spare. Doesnt matter with black but if you gonna load a 76 with smokeyless you need that crimp groove to work good ! We got some recoil and near on a pound of ammo in the mag slamming back each shot - bolits pushed back into case is not a smart plan.
 
     

[Coal Creek Griff]

Thank you, Greyhawk. I appreciate your step-by-step guide. It's also good to know that the cases fit the Lyman trimmer. The 45-75 and the 56-50 cases have a similar rim size, so they should both work. When I bought the Wilson trimmer, my focus was precision .223 cartridges and I wasn't worried about obscure cartridges. Now I wish I had just gone for an "ordinary" trimmer from the start.

CC Griff

[Cliff Fendley]

I was just on Captech website and noticed all brass shows out of stock. Has something happened to them. I stocked up decent on 45-75 but if it becomes available again I would buy so more for future.

[King Medallion]

I got an extra hundred as well, and it appears to be good brass, hopefully they hold up to lots of firings. I don't full size resize, neck only. Time will tell I reckon. I sent an email to Starline about 45/75 brass, but got no reply.