Spencer as a Buffalo gun

[Big Goose]

Here's a picture of the first buffalo that I shot with my original 56-56 Army Infantry Model Spencer rifle. It was with considerable trepidation that I took the Spencer buffalo hunting as I had several guys insist that there was no way that a puny Spencer would cleanly kill a bison.I figured that if Bill Cody used one that it would work for me as well.( He actually said that though for most of the buffalo that he killed he had used his "Lucrecia Borgia" trapdoor Springfield 50-70,He did use a Spencer on occation and much preferred it to those peashooter Henrys and even the Winchester 73.) I also figured that a 380 grain bullet at about 1100 fps is going to perform just fine with proper shot placement.Since the bore in my old girl is less than perfect, I set a distance limit of 75 yards as that is about the farthest I can consistently hit a coffee can with it.( a coffee can being about the size of a buffalo heart)
  To get close enough to the herd I made a cedar framework and attached a tanned buffalo hide over it and it actually looked a lot like a buffalo especially from the side view.It worked GREAT, although I really wouldn't recommend it as a couple of the big bulls seemed to be way too interested  in the "new Cow"in the herd.( These were about as wild as buffalo get on the Assinaboine Reservation in northern MT.and would spook at the merest sight of people)
    One cow finally presented a broadside shot at about 65 to 70 yards away and I poked the old Spencer's barrel out of my "Buff Cow's mouth" and touched her off with a neat orange flash, white smoke and KERBOOM. and the bullet broke a rib on the way in and on the way out and is now somewhere in the Montana prairie. Heart shot she stumbled about ten steps and kerflopped on the prairie.  As soon as I stepped from under the hide the entire herd whirled and took off, didnt stop till they were out of sight. I gave the cow a final offering of prairie grass and sage, and my Indian guide shared a pipe of kinnikinnik with me before we hoisted her up and started skinning. It was one of the grandest times I've ever spent hunting and just wanted to share the moment.Smoked buffalo tongue and hump meat mmmm




Big Goose

[Fox Creek Kid]

Now that's a helluva good story!! Thanks for posting!! 

[Harve Curry]

Hey Big Goose,
That is really neat. Good hunting for sure. I like how you snuck up on them. And the fat heavy slow moving Spencer bullet went right on through, original Spencer and all. You cannot ask for more then that.
Folks around here try to discourage me from using my original 1865 carbine for just what you did. If I get drawn for oryx I'll use the Spencer or nothing. Might try the hide trick.
One question, does the long barrel increase the velocity?
regards, Bill

[Caleb Hobbs]

That's a great story and a great picture. If you have any other photos, I know I'd like to see them, and I suspect others would, too. Especially a photo of that cedar-wood buff.
Caleb Hobbs

[Big Goose]

Yes, I suspect that the longer barrel does give a little higher velocities, though I'm only able to get 42 grains of 2F(compressed) in the case so even a carbine should have decent velocities with a similar load. I chronograpghed my loads and they averaged almost exactly 1100 fps, a low of 1092 to a high of 1110. At reasonable ranges I think that I would feel comfortable hunting anything in North America, bison are about the biggest land animals here.
  Also I do have some more pitures and some of the buffalo hide apparatus- I will have to resize and post them too.
Big Goose

[Deadeye Don]

Hey you are suppose to eat that buffalo tongue raw and warm.   

[Bead Swinger]

That's a helluva nice Spencer too   What's her serial number?

[Delmonico]

Hey you are suppose to eat that buffalo tongue raw and warm.   

No you eat the liver raw with some gall from the gall bladder, the tounge you either smoke or boil, slice and fry in butter or the marrow from the bones.

Oh and no reason the Spencer ain't big enough if you stalk close and put the bullet where it belongs.

[Dakota Widowmaker]

Its just like in sales...


"Location, location, location"

[SEA3PO]

Two years ago I took a large buffalo in Kansas with my Sharps.... at a distance of 75 yards...and to tell you I was not thrilled would be a darn lie... I was stoked... took two shots to the heart and that darn thing diden't die for at least 10 minutes...(might have been a bit quicker) but with all going around me it was pretty hectic... the herd goes wild...guards are looking for the intruder...I layed real still after shooting...one of our pack horses (far away in a gully, panic and ran at full speed......hobbled fore and aft...amazing)
I was shooting full 50-70 ammo with heavy bullets.... I would worry about the Spencer not being able to penetrate at distance.... 

Joel
SEA3PO

[R-71]

That is a nice buff, I read about using the spencer as buffalo gun and at the time figured it was underpowered. Then I got to thinking about all the critters shot with handguns. The Spencer round is easily more powerful than many hunting revolvers.

a 350grain bullet moving 1100fps is anything but weak!

I would like to do this one day myself.

Dan

[Big Goose]

Good Day to all,
it's been a while since I've had a chance to post here.Yup, I think that the Spencer has been really under rated as a decent hunting cartridge.  Since my buff hunt I had the opportunity to shoot a nice little whitetail buck with it, quartering towards me, hit it in the left front shoulder and the bullet exited out the right rear quarter. Meat damage was really not bad even though it broke the shoulder at the joint and femur about 3 inches below the hip.  Of course he went down like lightening struck him. As long as one keeps the range reasonable  the Spencer will do nicely. That said, it is I suppose on the light end for buffalo hunting, especially as that short fat bullet sheds velocity so quickly, but I'd not hesitate to use the old girl again!
  My favorite rifle is my old Spencer, but my favorite cartridge is the 50-70. I have two, one is a 71 Remington N.Y.state militia model and the other I built on an original Remington roller action with a Green Mountain barrel, in a Gemmer style. I've shot buffs with both of them and both were one shot kills. I try to take those quartering away shots to hit the heart and break the off shoulder. I've seen a buffalo cow shot through both lungs stay on her feet for over 20 minutes( she was bunched in the herd and my buddy Jim couldn't get another clear shot.)Finally she drifted out and he hit her in the shoulder(Shilo 74 Sharps, 45-70) Our group has taken several buffs and I've only seen a couple shots that didn't completely penetrate(that was a 43 Spanish with real soft 40-1 cast bullets, stopped on the far shoulder) And on one that I shot with my Northwest trade gun, a flintlock smoothbore, in 12 guage, that ball also stopped against the far shoulder)Anyway I guess that I've rambled on enough-
Have a fine day, Chris

[Arizona Trooper]

Great Hunt!!!!! Thanks for the report.

Here's an example of the velocity difference between a 20 and 30 inch barrel. Unfortunately, I didn't have a 52 cal. carbine when I made these tests. Since then, I've switched from felt WonderWads to card wads. They work just as well and are way cheaper.


                        M-1865 Rifle, .50 Cal., 30" bbl.    N.M. Carbine, .50 Cal., 20" bbl.
35 gr. GOEX FF                931 FPS                                873 FPS
40 gr. GOEX FF              1016 FPS                                     965 FPS
35 gr. GOEX CTG             939 FPS*                                   883 FPS*
40 gr. GOEX CTG           1033 FPS                                     996 FPS


* This load gave the lowest standard deviation.

All loads used the following components.
·   Cut down Dixie 50-70 cases.
·   50 Cal. bullet shortened Lyman 515141, 50/50 soft lead/wheelweight, 375gr.
·   Bullet lube 50/50 Bore Butter/Bee's Wax.
·   Winchester Large Rifle Magnum Primers.
·   35 gr. loads used Ox Yoke 50 cal. "Wonder Wads" over powder.

[dm3280]

I have to agree, shooting a buffalo with any BP weapon is a BIG rush.  I shot one in 2004 at Thousand Hills with a 45-70 Sharps.  I had to take the shot at around 300 yards.  Man, the closer I got to it after it was down the bigger it got.  The only thing I did not like about my hunt was after months of shooting and preparation it was over in a matter of minutes.  I would do it over in a heart beat if I had the $.  I can only imagine that shooting one with a true antique and one that some say is under powered had to be a big thrill. 

Was the meat tough?  My bull was about 9 years old and boy was that meat tough.  The only way we could eat it was ground or pressure cooked. 

If you ever get to the Denver area go eat at the restraunt called The Fort south of Denver.  The mainly serve bison, elk, quail, etc.  Now that is good buffalo.

[Big Goose]

I've got to say that the 5 year old buffalo cow that I shot with the Spencer was as fine eating as any beef  I've ever eaten- the loin steaks and hump meat would practically melt in your mouth. I did shoot an old cull buff cow in Feb. 07, (50-70 Gemmer style roller) and we called her "Tuffalo" even the burger was on the tough side, tasty though.She was old and very lean but did have a really nice huge winter prime hide. Overall the late October killed cows have been absolutely great eating and they are generally older, cull animals, but in fine condition that time of the year.
  And thanks, A.T., for the data, very interesting. My old 56-56 has a generous .546 bore, I also use cut down 50-70 brass(Starline) Federal 215 primers and 42 gr. 2F Goex(by weight, more like 45 grs. in a volumetric measure, is my scale off?). I cast my bullets out of a Rapine mold- heeled and weigh about 380 grs. out of 40-1 alloy. Lube is homemade - beeswax, jojoba oil, a little buffalo tallow, and a dash of oil soap. It seems to work fine for all my B.P. loads.

[Two Flints]

Currently being offered on Gunbroker.com   Check it out.  Lots of photos.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=106166899

and here, too.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=105590825

[SEA3PO]

My son killed his buffalo with 3 shots from a modern 45/70 Guide gun.... my Sharps carbine (original) shooting heavy bullet 50/70 only took 2 shots.... both heart shots..  I think it was the weight of the bullet that made the difference.    Absolutely thrilling hunting.... 
I think the Spencer should do well, but the Sharps really did the trick...

SEA3PO